Author Topic: Weighting  (Read 3913 times)

Hi,

are there any plans to add weighting (weighted tangents) to the baker of Designer/Painter?
Last Edit: January 19, 2017, 10:08:41 am

Hey, do you have some more details about this type of baker?

There is a nice polycount thread about weighted tangents, but I seem to be unable to find it atm

here is a link to the polycount wiki: http://wiki.polycount.com/wiki/VertexNormal#Weighted_Vertex_Normals



Since more engines are using weighted tangents, this would be a nice addition to all sorts of bakers


just found the thread, I was mentioning above: http://polycount.com/discussion/85809/face-weighted-normals/p1

Cheers, I'll share with the team

cheers, Vincent!

You control the vertex normals in your 3D app, not in the baker.  So I don't quite understand what is the relation between the technique of face weighted normals and the baking process?

If you are using face weighted normals to control the shading, you don't need a normal map to fake the shading.  That's the whole point of the technique.  You can bake this down to an even more optimized low poly mesh, but I don't know why you would want to do that. Polys are quite cheap to render these days.
Last Edit: January 22, 2017, 04:49:08 am

You control the vertex normals in your 3D app, not in the baker.  So I don't quite understand what is the relation between the technique of face weighted normals and the baking process?

If you are using face weighted normals to control the shading, you don't need a normal map to fake the shading.  That's the whole point of the technique.  You can bake this down to an even more optimized low poly mesh, but I don't know why you would want to do that. Polys are quite cheap to render these days.
I actually got the same answer from the team.

thanks for the replies!

I had assumed, that baking is different for an engine, that is using face weighted normals (fwn) from baking for an engine, that is not using fwn.

but it makes sense, that this information actually comes with the model (which then affects the bake)

so if I am using i.e. 3ds max fwn and want to bake it properly, I have to import as an triangulated fbx with weighted tangents on.


"If you are using face weighted normals to control the shading, you don't need a normal map to fake the shading.  That's the whole point of the technique."


I don't agree to this. no matter if you use fwn or not, there will still be normal mapping involved in (most) game productions. The whole point of fwn is to let the normal map do less work, not to replace it.


What I meant is, you don't need a normal map to fake the shading on the edges, since you are already doing that using custom normals.   You would of course use normal maps to give your meshes its material properties and extra details needed.

I'd suggest taking a look at Star Citizen, they use this technique combined with mesh decals very heavily to achieve high fidelity of details while still keeping texture memory low.

Thanks for you input, zurhoch.
That's an interesting approach. If the normal map isn't bound to the position of the bevels anymore, it opens many opportunities for optimisation.
Creating a set of tiling normal maps, and using + overlaying them via masks for example... I imagine it hard to find a good workflow for reducing the texture space that way, but still have enough texture space for the other maps.

Maybe that's an occasion for this workflow: https://www.allegorithmic.com/blog/next-frontier-texturing-workflows

I will check out Star Citizen, as soon as it's released (I have this habit of not looking at games before they are released, if I intend to play them)
Last Edit: January 25, 2017, 10:59:32 am

Hey michael_11, I'm pretty sure zurhoch meant something like this thread and not the game itself. Decal technique from Star Citizen is being discussed there from a technical standpoint.

 :) I know, I just never look at artwork or game content of a game I am planning to play.

thanks for the link! another massive normal-related polycount thread. like!  :D

hope I find some time to establish a synced fwt workflow between 3dsmax/maya and unity.