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Messages - Xathian

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1
So long as it's not the first time Painter has been installed on your PC the installer pulls a default install directory from your Registry and as such will always try to reinstall over the current version installed. Try using an installer switch to force an install into a different directory.

Download the installer from the website directly (not the launcher) into a folder.
Navigate to that folder and shift-right click an emptry area and select "Open command window here"
Run the exe with a /DIR command such as /DIR="X:\Directory\to\use

For example, if I wanted to install to my "Software" folder on my D drive I would use

SubstancePainter_Installer.exe /DIR="D:\Software\Substance Painter"

I am not certain this will work, I've never tried it myself but it's a common install switch for many softwares. I'm just not sure how shared registry values will work out between multiple installs of the software

2
Have you started a blank project without those default channel enabled?


3
WARNING: This is going to be a very longwinded post, sorry, but I have to describe the issue as best I can and I can't really see how cut it down much.

This is a feature I've been waiting on for years, and at first I was extremely excited to see it in the feature showcase, but it seems like a very strange way to handle this feature. Why not just give us a permanent panel list of the mesh subobjects, just like how it gives you a list when you open the Geometry Mask selector:



Except have this always available as a normal panel to hide or show mesh objects without the need for having a layer stack associated with the mesh objects and using that layer as the basis for hiding/showing objects.

An example of why this current system just doesn't work for me in my workflow is as follows. I am currently working with a team I was hired for on a VR project, like many VR games it is a shooting game and I have been doing props and guns. This mesh object hiding was a big deal for me because the game requires most guns be field strippable, meaning they can be partially disassembled so I have to model and texture the interiors. Prior to this it meant I had to basically have my gun "exploded" in the viewport so I could see inside it, similar to how you used to explode your models for baking before baking by mesh names was a thing.

This system of mesh hiding would allow me to have the model in the viewport in a final setup and let me hide parts as I worked, great in theory. However due to this being tied to layers as a sort-of mask, this disrupts my workflow and I can't find an efficient way around it. Normally my workflow would involve a gun needing maybe 4-6 major materials on it with each folder masking masked across several parts. For the primary ones I would have layers in my stack like this:

Wood
BodyMetal (Primarily the gun metal external parts)
InternalMetal (Likely uncoated, more polished steel internal parts)
OtherMetal (Screws, etc)
Plastic
Polymer

And maybe others if the weapon called for it. My first assumption was simple: I will work in my layers on each piece individually. For example I will place a Geometry Mask on the BodyMetal layer and select the Upper Receiver mesh objects, texture it both inside and out, then change the Geometry Mask to the Lower Receiver and texture that part inside and out, etc. Unfortunately this does not work, because of the non-destructive strokes feature mentioned here

https://youtu.be/TGASuIGSUns?t=598

Time code 9:58 if the link fails to skip to it. Painter preserves my brush strokes between changes in the Geometry Mask, meaning if I Geometry Mask 1 part of the object, finishing texturing it and then try to change the Geometry Mask to a different part of the mesh next, it will plaster my stroke history all over the new part when I change mesh objects. Playing around with Painter today my only solution I could think of was to effectively make a base layer folder for every single part of the model and assign each one a Geometry Mask for that mesh part

Grip
UpperRec
LowerRec
Trigger
ChargingHandle
Stock
Magazine
GripBolts
Etc
Etc

The basic model I had tried this on needed 14 folder layers to achieve a workable, hideable geometry mask on everything. However, if I do this workflow to get full control of mesh hiding and I want something like my BodyMetal material layer to be on 6 parts of the model, I now need that layer stack copy pasted inside all 6 folders. This is a great way to end up with 500 layers in your project and a completely unusable calculation time any time you want to update the layers. (I think layer instantiation will make this easier for a UDIM based model but this is for a game, no UDIMs here)

So my thoughts on how to solve this are either:

1) Allow us a separate mesh object hide/show panel that has nothing to do with layer masking to turn objects on or off
2) Allow us the option to disable the "non-destructive strokes" being reapplied to the mesh whenever we change the Geometry Mask to different subobjects (such as I tried doing in the first part I spoke of)

Otherwise I can't think of anything else to what I am trying, if anyone else has any idea please share because I spent the evening screwing around with this and couldn't get it working at all.

4
I was using Designer last week flawlessly, but today I launch it and everything is broken. Every menu comes up very slowly, all the 3D preview meshes are displayed as multiple planes, here's the cube:



Using the colour dropper for any reason locks up my PC entirely (mouse still moves though)

I tried updating and fully reinstalling and nothing fixes it.

5
Yeah you'll need to just go back to Mari. Painting across sets has been "in the works" for longer than Avatar 2 and given the now slowed to a crawl pace of feature updates (Hello Painter 2019.2, big summer update with zero new features just a speed improvement on baking so it's finally as fast as Marmoset has been since 2017) I would not hold my breath for this feature ever happening, especially given the track record on updates from their parent company.

6
This is absolutely insanity causing, all your other software packages can have ctrl+z undo your previous change to sliders, in Alchemist it doesn't, if you drop down a filter and change 10 sliders then press ctrl+z (out of habit especially) for a quick before/after check you will instead just undo the entire filter being added and have to redo all the values again.

Also there needs to be a UI indicator that a project is saving/was saved (bottom right of Painter shows this). Get paranoid my ctrl+s wasn't registered during a layer calculation.

7
At a time of change, the people at Allegorithmic needed your support but you all let them down.

Yeah no, the exact opposite happened, they let us down. Brown nosing will get you no where.

8
Looks like Gahdmor on Reddit just accidentally let slip Substances move to Creative Cloud. They've been trying really hard to dodge the question since the announcement but when someone complained about having to pay $60 for CC he replied that you could just choose Substance rather than the entire thing. Cute that they keep claiming that nothing is decided yet and they're still working on it but it's obvious it's all decided already



Don't listen to a word these Staff posters are saying, they're lying through their teeth.

9
1) It makes Painter look easy to use
There's no fast mouse movements or anything too complex going on. It makes the viewer think "hey, I could easily stamp my logo onto a 3D product! That's awesome!"

THIS IS NOT A GOOD THING. We are using and want PROFESSIONAL software, not Adobe Stock 3D Asset Stamp and Post Instagram bait.

I have to point out one very strange thing going on in this thread. On the one hand we have calls like this for professional software, on the other we have probably the same people complaining that CC rental scheme is too expensive... at 10 bucks a month for Photoshop. I'd say at least pick one, because both is pretty silly.

It's $10 a month in 12 month commitments, cancel early and you pay every remaining month of that year, also you never own the software and pay forever and ever and ever, also it requires you install a bloated, so poorly made it's borderline malware CC launcher.

Painter + Designer + B2M with Substance Source credits are $20 combined, they can be cancelled at any time without commitment fees, you can buy perpetual licenses or convert a 12 month rental license into a perpetual and each one is a standalone program installed from its own .exe with no bloated launcher.

They are not comparable in any way.

Still for anyone proclaiming they need professional software, 10 bucks a month is ridiculously cheap. No matter how long you pay it, Photoshop for 10 bucks a month is a steal.

No, the only steal happening on this business model is the theft Adobe is committing by making you pay forever and never own anything. You're not pointing out anything, you're being a contrarian for the sake of standing out online.

It's cute that you keep hanging onto Photoshop too, and ignore the $20.99 price tag for everything else they sell, all individually. You won't pay $20 for the Substance Suite, you'll pay $20.99 for B2M, $20.99 for Designer and $20.99 for Painter.

Just like you have to today if you want Premiere + After Effects + Audition as a full video creation suite.

10
Okay, Thanks for the info, Jeremie. I just hope they will be available as they were - downloadable .rpm packages, and not part of the bloated CC.

Substance is moving to the Creative Cloud, Adobe made this abundantly clear.

https://theblog.adobe.com/adobe-acquires-allegorithmic-substance-3D-gaming/

11
1) It makes Painter look easy to use
There's no fast mouse movements or anything too complex going on. It makes the viewer think "hey, I could easily stamp my logo onto a 3D product! That's awesome!"

THIS IS NOT A GOOD THING. We are using and want PROFESSIONAL software, not Adobe Stock 3D Asset Stamp and Post Instagram bait.

I have to point out one very strange thing going on in this thread. On the one hand we have calls like this for professional software, on the other we have probably the same people complaining that CC rental scheme is too expensive... at 10 bucks a month for Photoshop. I'd say at least pick one, because both is pretty silly.

It's $10 a month in 12 month commitments, cancel early and you pay every remaining month of that year, also you never own the software and pay forever and ever and ever, also it requires you install a bloated, so poorly made it's borderline malware CC launcher.

Painter + Designer + B2M with Substance Source credits are $20 combined, they can be cancelled at any time without commitment fees, you can buy perpetual licenses or convert a 12 month rental license into a perpetual and each one is a standalone program installed from its own .exe with no bloated launcher.

They are not comparable in any way.

12
Allegorithmic,

What do you have to say to all the commissioned artists, indie developers and hobbyists who propped up your product and got it pushed into production pipelines all over the industry to bring you to  where you are now?

What do you say to the people who will not be able to afford your product once its been re-priced and re-branded for the Adobe CC lineup?

I don't want to seem ungrateful, we are super grateful to the indie community, but I'd like us to be given props where due.

Indie developpers and hobbyists didn't push Substance into production studios. We did, by tirelessely vising every studio on earth over and over again for years and work them until we convinced them that these were the right tools for the job. The notoriety of the tools then trickled down from studios like Naughty Dog, Treyarch, Turn10, etc. into smaller studios and the indie community at large.
I personnally spent 2 years of my life constantly flying from country to country to present Substance Designer to studios who only swore by Photoshop, and slowly but surely, we changed their minds. And we're not going to abandon them, or the Indie guys, now.

As for the price, if you were able to afford Substance now, you'll be able to afford them in the future, don't worry.

Well you've adapted to the Adobe Corporate Arrogance pretty well.

13
1) It makes Painter look easy to use
There's no fast mouse movements or anything too complex going on. It makes the viewer think "hey, I could easily stamp my logo onto a 3D product! That's awesome!"

THIS IS NOT A GOOD THING. We are using and want PROFESSIONAL software, not Adobe Stock 3D Asset Stamp and Post Instagram bait.

2) It makes Painter look like it's on even-footing with Dimension
I think it's more than likely that the low frame-rate was a conscious decision. If Painter's viewer both looked nicer and ran better than Dimension's, it would reflect poorly on Adobe's own product.

Now this is downright delusional. Come on, man. They made Substance look laggy to make it fair for Dimension? Anyone that cares for 3D already understands that a render is a slow thing, and them trying to hide that shows they aren't marketing towards people who do proper 3D work.

14
I found this. Who knows, they might even make 3D modeling software and become a competitor to Autodesk but as a Blender user I simply don't care.



They won't make 3D software, they'll just buy Maxon. Plus, the LAST thing you should want is them making 3D software, this is a texturing suite, we don't need it to get sidetracked to go on a farce of developing every tool imaginable, that's how you end up with half baked shitty software.

15
they 'have to' say most  heartwarming and cushy things about Adobe products now.
need to do your own research and tests

'You can buy these wonderful models from https://stock.adobe.com/3d-assets and make your designer friends jealous with your renders yeyyy'
My favorites are garlic model and 'LOVE' text.

From the Peter Jackson moment
“Adobe is bringing Allegorithmic on board so that we can, along with the incredible talent at Adobe which has already been working on 3D projects and research, invent the next generation of 3D creative tools, with Substance as a flagship product, but also combining Adobe’s own current 3D initiatives like Adobe Dimension, and more,”

so their priority will never ever be games and films.

It's $30 a month to get 10 assets off that store. Hooo boy the quality you get for the price.

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