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Messages - dgoyette

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1
Some time ago, I made a "Grunge" picker SBS. The input is an integer, and the output is a grayscale image. You can see an image of this attached.

Basically, it just uses a big switch to return a different grunge image depending on the integer given to it. This seemed to work pretty well, but what I've found is that this SBS can easily crash Substance Designer in a couple of ways. The most noticeable is that when generating thumbnails for any SBSs that use this generator, it seems that loading this SBS forces all of those grunge textures to load, one for every thumbnail. My system immediately runs out of memory.

I was looking for an alternative approach to using dynamic grunge maps in this way, if one exists. Is there a way I can "lazy load" the grunge textures, so that they don't all load every time something tries to generate a single grunge image?

It's worth mentioning that the image below shows the generator using a combination of "Grunge Map" nodes, and "Grunge Map Bitmap" nodes. I thought maybe it was the bitmap nodes causing the problems, and removed them. But, the same memory issues apply even when the graph contains only the generator nodes, and no bitmap nodes.

2
Just to close things up here, I've tracked it down to a single SBS that was being used by a large number of other SBSs: A "grunge" picker SBS, which I've attached. It included 23 "Grunge Map" bitmaps, along with a selector to choose one based on a parameter. It seems that in generating thumbnails, each SBS Cooker process probably has to load all of those images into memory. This SBS is design to allow easy selection of different Grunge maps via a slider, but I'll look at changing my approach there.

3
Thanks for the reply. I wasn't aware that I had any particular complex content in my Library. It's basically just full of SBS and SBSARs that I've downloaded from Substance Source. However, it seems I can reproduce this issue easily by filtering the library on some very inclusive filter (such as the letter "e") and scrolling down through the results.

I then noticed the log file was complaining about a couple of SBS:

Code: [Select]
[ERROR][Thumbnails Generator ] launch application:
   D:/Programs/Substance Designer/sbscooker.exe --inputs C:/Users/Dan/Documents/GitHub/Gravia/Assets/Materials/Substance/Gravia/Detail/SBS/DirtDetails.sbs --alias sbs://D:\Programs\Substance Designer\resources\packages --alias sd-3dview-maps://D:/Programs/Substance Designer/resources/view3d/maps --alias sd-3dview-shapes://D:/Programs/Substance Designer/resources/view3d/shapes --alias sd-3dview-shaders://D:/Programs/Substance Designer/resources/view3d/shaders --output-path C:/Users/Dan/AppData/Local/Temp/Allegorithmic/Substance Designer/thumbs --output-name ZpaAFY_tmp --expose-output-size 1 --expose-random-seed 1 --expose-pixel-size 1 --size-limit 7 --compression-mode 2 --no-optimization
Execution failed ! (Exit Code: 1)
[ERROR][Thumbnails Generator ] launch application:
   D:/Programs/Substance Designer/sbscooker.exe --inputs C:/Users/Dan/Documents/GitHub/Gravia/Assets/Materials/Substance/Gravia/Detail/SBS/DirtDetails.sbs --alias sbs://D:\Programs\Substance Designer\resources\packages --alias sd-3dview-maps://D:/Programs/Substance Designer/resources/view3d/maps --alias sd-3dview-shapes://D:/Programs/Substance Designer/resources/view3d/shapes --alias sd-3dview-shaders://D:/Programs/Substance Designer/resources/view3d/shaders --output-path C:/Users/Dan/AppData/Local/Temp/Allegorithmic/Substance Designer/thumbs --output-name ApPODt_tmp --expose-output-size 1 --expose-random-seed 1 --expose-pixel-size 1 --size-limit 7 --compression-mode 2 --no-optimization
Execution failed ! (Exit Code: 1)
[ERROR][Thumbnails Generator ] launch application:
   D:/Programs/Substance Designer/sbscooker.exe --inputs C:/Users/Dan/Documents/GitHub/Gravia/Assets/Materials/Substance/Gravia/Decals/DecalPaint/DecalPaint.sbs --alias sbs://D:\Programs\Substance Designer\resources\packages --alias sd-3dview-maps://D:/Programs/Substance Designer/resources/view3d/maps --alias sd-3dview-shapes://D:/Programs/Substance Designer/resources/view3d/shapes --alias sd-3dview-shaders://D:/Programs/Substance Designer/resources/view3d/shaders --output-path C:/Users/Dan/AppData/Local/Temp/Allegorithmic/Substance Designer/thumbs --output-name wFjxHa_tmp --expose-output-size 1 --expose-random-seed 1 --expose-pixel-size 1 --size-limit 7 --compression-mode 2 --no-optimization
Execution failed ! (Exit Code: 1)
[ERROR][Thumbnails Generator ] launch application:
   D:/Programs/Substance Designer/sbscooker.exe --inputs C:/Users/Dan/Documents/GitHub/Gravia/Assets/Materials/Substance/Gravia/Decals/Dirt/DirtDecals.sbs --alias sbs://D:\Programs\Substance Designer\resources\packages --alias sd-3dview-maps://D:/Programs/Substance Designer/resources/view3d/maps --alias sd-3dview-shapes://D:/Programs/Substance Designer/resources/view3d/shapes --alias sd-3dview-shaders://D:/Programs/Substance Designer/resources/view3d/shaders --output-path C:/Users/Dan/AppData/Local/Temp/Allegorithmic/Substance Designer/thumbs --output-name jreNAH_tmp --expose-output-size 1 --expose-random-seed 1 --expose-pixel-size 1 --size-limit 7 --compression-mode 2 --no-optimization
Execution failed ! (Exit Code: 1)
[ERROR][Thumbnails Generator ] launch application:
   D:/Programs/Substance Designer/sbscooker.exe --inputs C:/Users/Dan/Documents/GitHub/Gravia/Assets/Materials/Substance/Gravia/Detail/SBS/DirtDetails.sbs --alias sbs://D:\Programs\Substance Designer\resources\packages --alias sd-3dview-maps://D:/Programs/Substance Designer/resources/view3d/maps --alias sd-3dview-shapes://D:/Programs/Substance Designer/resources/view3d/shapes --alias sd-3dview-shaders://D:/Programs/Substance Designer/resources/view3d/shaders --output-path C:/Users/Dan/AppData/Local/Temp/Allegorithmic/Substance Designer/thumbs --output-name nTgDMp_tmp --expose-output-size 1 --expose-random-seed 1 --expose-pixel-size 1 --size-limit 7 --compression-mode 2 --no-optimization
Execution failed ! (Exit Code: 1)


Error:
[WARNING][SBSCooker]Size out of bounds:

   Size: 256x256

   From Graph: pkg:///GrungeGenerator?dependency=1319742106

   ... (repeated 54 more times)

So I guess that's something to go on. I'll have to figure out why those are causing memory issues when generating thumbnails. Maybe there's some way to disable thumbnail generation for specific items known to have issues? Or is there some other way to avoid this kind of thing happening in general?

4
I've been noticing this for a month or two now. While working in Substance Designer, suddenly my system will seem to start locking up. Sometimes I'm able to open Task Manager and see what's going on, and it will show me that multiple sbscooker processes are running, each using somewhere around 8 GB of RAM. This cripples the system, since it starts swapping to disk.

This has occurred sometimes within 30 seconds of just starting a new, empty substance, and it doesn't seem correlated to any particular SBS I'm working on. It just seems to happen at random while I'm using Substance Designer.

I'm on 2020.1.3, and I don't see anyone else complaining about this on the forums. How can I provide some useful information so you can figure out what's happening here? Again, this can happen on a brand new file, which I haven't even saved yet, but it's not something I can reliably reproduce. Is there a log file I can look at the next time this happens, which I could provide? Or is this perhaps already a known issue?

5
A while back, I thought I understood this problem, and discussed it here:

https://forum.substance3d.com/index.php?topic=30937.0

However, I clearly still don't understand what's going on, and it seems like such a simple thing. All I'm trying to do is paint a model exported from Blender, which has a Mirror Modifier on it. The result is that the model comes into Substance Painter mostly correctly, except that there are very visible seams along the mirror lines. I'd mostly like to know if it's truly possible to export a model from Blender with a Mirror Model on it, and have it look correct in Substance Painter.

The simplest example I can think of is a cube, which I cut in half, and then mirror in Blender:



It's UV unwrapped:




However, this is the result when I bring it into Substance Painter:



The seam line between the two halves is clearly visible.


The point of using a Mirror Modifier in Blender is to avoid duplicating work, and to keep the texture density high. If I apply the modifier, and then unwrap the model again, I can get rid of the seam, but then I've lost the ability to mirror the object, and the texture won't be mirrored.

Does anyone else use Blender, mirror an object, and then paint it in SP? I've tried several things so far, none of which has helped:
  • Offsetting the UVs by 1 unit
  • Flipping the UVs
  • Applying the Mirror Modifier manually before exporting. In that case, it's identical to letting the FBX Export apply modifiers on export.
  • Removing doubles, making sure nothing is marked sharp, making sure everything is marked sharp, nothing changes.

6
Thanks for clarifying. That all sounds reasonable, given that HDRP only officially comes out of "preview" with 2019.3 anyway.

7
Your 2.4.5 release will support 2019.3, or require 2019.3? I assume that you're not saying that as of 2.4.5, the plugin will no longer support 2018.3?

8
The asset store claims that you support 2017.3 and higher.



Your website here states you support Unity 2018 and Unity 2019:

https://docs.substance3d.com/integrations/unity-170459323.html

So what versions do you actually support, if these resources aren't correct?

This seems like a serious problem. Remember that Unity's Asset Store doesn't allow people to download older versions of assets. So, if a previous version of the plugin was working in 2018.1, and you push out an update that breaks it, there's no way anyone can download an older version of the plugin via the asset store. Asset developers generally ensure that their assets are compatible with many versions of Unity for this reason, using precompile directives. Are you guys not doing that? Are you just letting older versions of Unity fall out of support with the plugin?

9
was also 4th option until recently

now I am back to 2nd option as the project relays upon substance a fair amount, which was originally made when substance was built into unity, upgraded unwittingly and after too much work couldn't go back

however with all that said, I have started to notice some improvements, just taking its time

I guess that's somewhat encouraging. The main reason I finally removed Substance from my project (probably about a year ago now) was because Allegorithmic was slow to support current versions of Unity. It was essentially the one thing in my project preventing me from upgrading Unity, or from being able to build my project due to some bug. There are still some things I'd like to be able to use the plugin for (dynamic writing on walls, for example), but I'm still not sure it's worth the risk of introducing a dependency on a still incomplete tool. If they're making progress, though, maybe some day they'll actually have enough confidence in the plugin to remove the "beta" label.

10
Personally, I stopped using Substance in Unity when native support was dropped, as I ran into too many issues with the new plugin to tolerate. I keep an eye on these forums to see if it feels like it's time to try the plugin again. But this forum doesn't get much traffic these days. It's not obvious to me whether that's because the plugin itself has stabilized to the point where people don't need as much support, or whether people have just stopped using the Substance plugin in their project.

The forum doesn't allow me to make a poll, so I'll just ask more generally: To current or former users of Substance in Unity, which best describes you right now:
  • I use the Substance plugin in my project, and it works fine. No problems here.
  • I use the Substance plugin in my project, but there are some problems, and I've had to implement some workarounds to deal with it.
  • I used to use Substance in my project, but I'm not using it now due to problems with the plugin.
  • I used to use Substance in my project, but I stopped using it due to some past issues. I haven't tried it again recently to see if it works better now.
  • Something else.

I'm in the 4th group: I had various issues/crashes with the plugin, going back probably a full year now, which perhaps have been resolved. But the fact that the plugin is still officially listed as being in "Beta" really doesn't inspire confidence. I was hoping to come back to Substance when it was stable, but it's not clear when they will be.

Mostly I'm curious whether the plugin has become nice and stable, or whether the long beta period has simply caused people to find other solutions instead of using the Substance plugin.

11
My normal SP process is to use Fill layers with a layer mask to control where each layer is used. In that sense, it seems I spend the majority of my time editing layer masks. As such, I feel like the current tooling for editing 2D layer masks feels very limited. I figured I'd ask if anyone knows of some clever ways to use the tool to edit layer masks that I don't yet know about, or if there are possibly any future plans to improve the experience.

Right now, there are four main ways to edit a layer mask:
  • Paint
  • Erase
  • Polygon Fill
  • Smudge

My current process generally involves using Polygon Fill for the big pieces, then switching to Erase or Paint for the fine details. I feel like I'm constantly painting/erasing, then undoing if it's not quite right, over and over again. Very often I want fairly simple behaviors, as far as an algorithm would be concerned, which are difficult to perform by hand. These include:
  • Growing/Shrinking a selection - Lets say I've painted a rectangle into the layer mask, I often want to just make that shape larger or smaller. In a 2D editing tool, this would be a simple select and scale operation, but in SP I just have to draw/erase by hand.
  • Drawing straight lines - Currently, I can draw a point, then hold Shift and click somewhere else, and it will draw a line between the first and second points. I use that all the time. But it has two really frustrating issues: First, if I draw a line like that, and it's not correct, I'll Undo to get rid of the line, and I'll try again. But now the "first" point has changed to the most recently point, so I can't keep trying to get the line just right. I draw from A to B, undo, now the start point is B, and I need to draw from B to A. I wish that when I undo a draw, it also returns the line start point to where it was when I started. Second, if I click somewhere, then move/zoom the UV Map or model at all, the point moves with it, instead of staying on the original position on the model/map. This means any time I want to draw a line like this, I have to make sure I don't zoom. This makes it much harder to draw long lines.
  • No lasso/shape tools - I constantly wish I could outline a region, like with a selection tool, and only fill it when I've got it the way I want. I want something as simple as drawing a rectangle with an arbitrary height/width. I know I can assign an alpha to the paint tool, but that's not the same as dragging a selection/shape rectangle.

Anyway, the big question is whether there's anything I'm missing about editing layer masks, to make it feel more like editing an image in photoshop?

12
Well, I was hoping the mask was treated separately from the content of the layer. Such that the content could be used across several texture sets, each with their own (potentially optional) mask.

In this case, is there a recommended approach to using the same content across multiple texture sets, allowing for distinct masks on each texture set? Right now I don't see a way to keep the content between multiple texture sets synchronized.

13
I'm trying to use the same base material across a couple of texture sets. I've created the fill on one texture set, and then used "Instantiate across Texture Sets" to use it on the others. However, it seems that if I have a mask on the layer, then nothing gets copied to the other texture sets.

Is this a bug? Or is this not supported?

14
For any material with "preset" options, I have to be extremely careful when scrolling up and down in the Properties window. The problem is that the dropdown for "Select Preset", for some reason, changes selection when scrolling via the mousewheel. If, while I'm scrolling in the inspector, the mouse cursor happens to land on this field, the next scrollwheel movement will be applied to the preset dropdown, completely changing the material.

This makes for a bad experience. When scrolling up and down in a window, I should be worried that I'm going to accidentally change some values. It's also unexpected because other dropdowns in SP don't behave this way. For example, the dropdown to choose "Normal Format" (DirectX or OpenGL) doesn't change its value when the scrollwheel used while hovered over it.

Here's a GIF of this happening. All I'm doing is scrolling down with the mouse wheel. At the point that the scrolling moves the Preset dropdown under my mouse, the next time I scroll is changes the value of the preset.

15
As much as I'd like to use the drag selection to fill faces, it seems completely unreliable. I would expect the tool to apply only to the faces of the mesh I can actually see. But instead, it seems to project infinitely far through the model, selecting/painting any faces it encounters, even if it hits a backface.

Please see the attached GIF. Starting from a model with no texture, I drag select to fill some polygons on the top of the model. But you can see that this actually fills all sorts of faces on the other side of the model.

Am I using this tool wrong? Is this a bug?

Edit: The GIF is here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/7i7hw389rnuxgzo/Drawing.gif?dl=0   Apparently trying to attach a GIF, or at least this GIF, results in a error trying to post the message.

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