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Messages - TooManyDemons

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Blender's layer-based material authoring work looks very promising so far! Dayum. I'm going to invest. It will be something no one can ever buy right out from under me and change the rules.

I really loved Substance, but in light of new events I can't trust it to be reliable (yet). Once everything settles down and the smoke clears I'll have a second look, maybe later in the year.

I've already been busy reworking my workflows and am discovering I can actually do a lot of very comparable things in near-equal quality and speed,  with Zbrush and 3D Coat. There are also tools to bake procedural textures from the node editor in Blender:

which is only one of many other tools that peeps are working on.

I think the indie community will be just fine, and will find clever ways to circumvent Adobe and prosper. It will be rocky, for sure. But to have a piece of software that does a nice texture job and can't be bought... just imagine that. Blender 2.8 already looks phenomenal...

Ton Roosendaal is Neo. He's going to save us all  8)


so... who immediately felt like punching this kid in the face?

I made an edge wear shader for Eevee, just as an example of what Blender may be able to do for texture work. You can see a preview of it in this gif:

It's a simple node that works right out of the box. Best on beveled objects and higher-poly models. Just plug the mask into a mix node, for example.

You can download it here:

I predict sculpting and height-map blending will become the new favorite ways to create materials.

Man oh man.... I been kicking back here, occasionally refreshing this page to read the wall of hate....

You know, if Allegorithmic were any other company, I would say that boycotting won't last, that people will simmer down and your popularity would soar again.

The problem is that Allegorithmic is a rockstar, like Harley Davidson or Marlboro. It's a name-brand thing, and it's gotten a very positive, unique and enjoyable rapport. That very same rapport may in fact make the blowback from this move actually felt. People may actually be mad enough to force themselves to find a harder way to do things and put down Substance completely, without looking back.

The Hundredth Monkey effect....

Just looking around at the various forums (polycount, reddit, youtube...) I think maybe the damage here will actually be lasting and felt.

We totally understand your fears, and we were expecting such reactions.
We chose to go and work with Adobe (nobody or nothing forced us to do this) because we truly believe this is the best move to still help rock the 3d world. We obviously talked a lot with Adobe people before doing this move, and we know that it's now our job to show you why we did it. We don't expect you to take any words for granting, this is by our actions that we will show you why we did it :)

In the meantime, you can read the blogpost from our CEO, explaining his feelings about it:

The question is, did this choice happen because you needed to merge for the benefit of your customer base? Or did this happen as per the post below which was strictly about meeting quarterly targets?

This merge happened because we chose it, and we believe in the project for which Adobe gave us the keys.
We've had lots of offers in the last years, and we decided to go with Adobe because we truly believe in it.

And we now have to prove you why we did this :)

I do appreciate your reply. It would help a lot of people if we could know exactly what benefits we're going to see from this merger. We all love Substance and the negativity in this thread is solely based on not wanting to see something we love using day to day go away, or become priced in a way that smaller studios cannot afford the subscription fees. I already know people are going to say what has been green lighted, but these are all valid concerns especially when Adobe has touched other companies less than desirable results have occurred.

If Adobe allows Allegorithmic to continue doing what they do best, and keep the packages at a reasonable rate I'm sure most people will be fine, but with news about merging into Creative Cloud, well... that doesn't seem too promising.

We obviously cannot say much yet, and today the only thing we can say is that if you trusted us in the past, please trust us, even just a little bit, when we say we feel it's the best chance to go on improving the 3d world. And we will prove you why we did this.

Thank you for your response Nicolas. I'll ride this out and see how things play out. I have no intention of dumping Substance due to the merger personally and I've spent a lot of man hours learning all the software and really enjoy it. There would have to be an unattractive change in pricing or features to make me do this, and only time will tell what will happen. I'm not going to lie, I am a bit nervous as are so many others as substance is intertwined in my workflow.

I will be looking at a perpetual license though once my subscription runs out in three months.

A word of warning, be careful with perpetual license. At the end of the day you're purchasing perpetual access to Substance in an agreement with Allegorithmic and when they cease to be Allegorithmic then your license granter no longer exists and that license is invalid. They will just turn off the current licensing servers.

The same happened with InstaLOD. They sold licenses for UE4 integrations and when they decided to rebrand the company all those licenses just died overnight and don't function anymore.

3D Coat, Quixel Suite, and (now) Blender 2.8 are going to become viable alternatives for individual users. The bigger companies and the elitists will still use Allegorithmic on a subscription model.

This is what will happen.

3D Coat has some nice painting tools (and even smart materials!) It's very photoshop-centric and a bit awkward to learn at first but you can get some really outstanding results in there that would rival a substance painter job. As someone who has both 3D Coat and Substance, I can attest to the rock solid painting tools in 3D Coat.

Personally I am a petty, covetous artist who loves to own his tools and build a neat little digital arsenal. It's a hobby.

'pay us, every month, forever and own nothing'

no thanks I'll pass. But I suppose the bigger companies wouldn't care about this, so to each his own.

If no one ever uses the renderer built into Designer then it's very stupid to have one built in to begin with.

A renderer of convenience should be convenient...  or it should just be removed completely.

That said, I have several friends who like to render their materials in Designer despite its fussiness. I think a second look at the lighting and setup system would make the software feel even more professional.


The lights in Substance Designer are so incredibly bad, that you only get to activate two, and are only able to move one of them.

This is a cruel joke for a program as popular and widely used as Substance Designer is. And for all the gorgeous renders of incredible procedural work that exist, this horrendous lighting setup is absolutely laughable. To make matters worse, the ONE light you can move is awkward and difficult to manipulate. Really, really awkward.

Every single Substance Designer user I know and have met, renders their newly created graph right inside the software.

I propose multiple movable lights of different types (spot, point, ect.) that you can add to your scene and manipulate using real 3D widgets. I very much hope this can happen soon.



A workaround for now is to open the default "start painting" file from the startup window. From there, create a new file. Your 2D view will be fixed.

Same I"m having this bug as well. But there is a workaround for now. If you open the default "start painting" file from the startup window (the one with Meet Mat), and then from there create a new file, it will fix your 2D view.

Sucks I know but that's what I've been doing for now.

I'm running into this as well :'(

Substance PainterSubstance Painter - Showcase - Re: TooManyDemons
 on: May 03, 2018, 09:39:47 pm 
Another fun hard surface project for UE4:

Substance PainterSubstance Painter - Showcase - Re: TooManyDemons
 on: May 03, 2018, 09:38:30 pm 
This belongs more in the Substance Designer category, but I'd like to keep my work on one place here...

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