Author Topic: Alpha see through..  (Read 8563 times)

Ok, im new here, so Hail to one and all.

Ive been slowly getting up to speed on designer/painter and although Im sure I'll have a lot of questions eventually, I'll like to start of with one that's really bothering me now.

I figured out how to do opacity (by making new node, and choosing opacity etc)

but.. on my mesh, there is 2 layers. one will have the opacity map on it, and the bit underneath will have another material. but. whatever I do, I cant see the other (underneath) mesh part. its just pure black, im now so confused, that I must be doing something wrong.

its Alpha maps.. it cant be that complicated.. : )

Thanks
A



Ok, im new here, so Hail to one and all.

Ive been slowly getting up to speed on designer/painter and although Im sure I'll have a lot of questions eventually, I'll like to start of with one that's really bothering me now.

I figured out how to do opacity (by making new node, and choosing opacity etc)

but.. on my mesh, there is 2 layers. one will have the opacity map on it, and the bit underneath will have another material. but. whatever I do, I cant see the other (underneath) mesh part. its just pure black, im now so confused, that I must be doing something wrong.

its Alpha maps.. it cant be that complicated.. : )

Thanks
A

Hi,

Can you post a screen shot of the setup? It sounds like you need to supply opacity data so that shader can show the transparency. Is the issue that you are not seeing the transparency in the 3D view?

Cheers,
Wes
Head of Substance Demo Art Team
the3dninja@adobe.com
Twitter: The3DNinja

Sure here it is.

As you can see on the test checkers. - I need to then see the speaker underneath. - but to no avail.

-Ive tried varies nodes, they all do the same thing, decent alpha, just not "transparent"
-Does the opacity material mesh need to be a separate 3D object?. i.e not attached at source (3dmax)

Thanks
A

Hey lowpolyandy,

you don't need the RGB-A Split. The checker pattern has no Alpha Channel and therefore it can't work this way. (and you already noticed that)
The checker pattern is just a pattern, not more: Black and White.

You can feed that into the Opacity output and everything what is white will be visible and everything what is black will be invisible/see through.
I hope that helps.


Best Regards
Environment Artist - Twitter

Hi Fabian.

Thanks for the reply.

Right, so, if its not an alpha then indeed none of them will work as I want them too, - I assumed that all the "generators" would have alpha in them...

So to get a full transparent image (generator) I must create just a normal alpha PNG like I normally would, import it to designer, and link up again... right?

(Thats my understanding of what your saying), correct me if Im wrong.

Andy

EDIT: no that did not work either. I created a basic alpha map. imported in and connected it to just the opacity output, but still showing the same results as the black n white checker.


Last Edit: February 24, 2016, 06:41:31 pm

Hmm I have to say Im really disappointed.
To have working alpha is necessary these days, and a complex program like this cant do a simple thing. (although painter can)

Ive gone through every node, every effect/shader with 3 testing of alpha bitmaps, PNG/TIFF and TGA - and I keep getting the same problem over and over.

there are no nodes that allow the use of full RGB color (the background) then also add in a opacity map to (remove the background with the alpha map) its basic stuff. add+subtract.
Ive wasted 7 hours to get nowhere.




Hey lowpolyandy,

I tried to understand what you want to achieve, excuse any misunderstanding.
You should be able to import images with an Alpha channel and use it in Substance Designer, but the generators and shapes work differently.

Lets make a simple Substance with a 'hole' in it. This hole is created with the Opacity Channel. (screenshot 1)

Substance Designer will handle everything in Channels, just like Substance Painter does. To see Opacity in Substance Painter, you'll need to add an Opacity channel. The same need to be done in Substance Designer.
Add an output and set the usage to 'opacity'.

A white Opacity means it is visible at this point and black means the image will be invisible there. Right-Clicking the graph and choose 'View outputs in 3d' lets you actually see the result in 3D.

To combine both the Opacity and the colour channel you'll need to hook up an RGB-A-Merge, just like I did in the example.
You can't see the opacity in the 3d view, though, because Substance Designer has no opacity channel set up to use it in my second screenshot.

The alpha channel in images not always means "Transparency". You need to tell the software to use the Alpha as transparency. In Substance this is being done when enabling the opacity channel.

Hopefully you understand that better now.


Best Regards
Last Edit: February 24, 2016, 09:42:19 pm
Environment Artist - Twitter

Hey Fabian.

Thanks once again for trying to resolve my problems. - but alas, no. - what your doing here is what Ive already done. and thats not what Im trying to do exactly.

Here is a image I did in VRAY (before I got substance) so I can dirty things up and "age" them.

But the same rules apply.

The mesh cloth (the red part) needs to be transparent, so I can see the speaker stuff underneath.

in 3dsmax. all I did was add a "plane" and add a bump/gloss/spec and opacity map

Turn to Designer, and it cant do this. - sure I can see things in the background (but there is no 3D opacity depth)

hopefully this will explain things better



Hey Fabian.

Thanks once again for trying to resolve my problems. - but alas, no. - what your doing here is what Ive already done. and thats not what Im trying to do exactly.

Here is a image I did in VRAY (before I got substance) so I can dirty things up and "age" them.

But the same rules apply.

The mesh cloth (the red part) needs to be transparent, so I can see the speaker stuff underneath.

in 3dsmax. all I did was add a "plane" and add a bump/gloss/spec and opacity map

Turn to Designer, and it cant do this. - sure I can see things in the background (but there is no 3D opacity depth)

hopefully this will explain things better

Hi Andy,

You can do this in Designer and the setup is actually similar to what you do in Max. In this example, I have a base color, normal (this provides the bump/depth), roughness(controls the specular amount) and opacity. You don't need to place an alpha in any of the other maps. You can just work with the opacity channel directly.

I have attached the substance project file. I used a single plane for the cloth areas. The shader is different, but you are using the same workflow where you are supplying an opacity map. The fibers of the cloth need to be used as a bump. In this case, you supply a normal map which is more accurate than a bump map.

Cheers,
Wes

 



Head of Substance Demo Art Team
the3dninja@adobe.com
Twitter: The3DNinja

Wes

Thats exactly the thing I want to do. - however, although you have it working, for me its very different.

I loaded your materials to my mesh. - and the opacity still not working like in your example.

this leads me to think it might be a setup configuration somewhere else that Ive overlooked?

Thankyou though.
Least I know its possible... though for me.. not just yet.

Ok I got it!!

Seems that with all the testing ive been doing today, my 3d card got messed up.. - rebooted and WES's suggestion worked perfectly!

wow.. long time to get a basic effect, but least I can sigh a breath of relief now!..
Thanks to all. and a special shoutout to WES!

A

Last Edit: February 24, 2016, 11:39:18 pm