Author Topic: 1.3 Issues with baking  (Read 4644 times)

First, just want say what a great update for surface painter. Apologies if there is a way round any of this and I just haven’t worked out how to do it.
After testing and using the update I am finding a few issues that are making it difficuilt to completely move to a baking workflow entirely in substance painter

Explodes/Baking

When baking normal maps, or any kind of textures, it is necessary to “explode” the mesh to stop polygons intersecting, especially when using a cage. See the screen attached. The only workflow I can see by doing this in painter is by exporting separate “exploded” meshes from our 3D app, bake in painter, exporting those images back out of painter, start a new painter project with a non- exploded mesh, import those textures and start painting.
What would be ideal is if we could use morphs in painter with imported fbx’s to get around this and speed up the workflow greatly. As a bonus, if this feature was implemented, we could use morphs as cages too!

Surface ID’s

I am unable to bake ID maps for use with low poly assets (unless I am missing something). For example the chest of drawers in the screen shot attached, has handles in the high poly asset which do not exist on the low poly asset (the normal map brings out the detail). I normally bake an ID map in an external package which creates a separate colour for the handles – I can then mask this out in painter use ID mask. In the new update I can’t find a way to bake ID maps to a low poly mesh which has one texture set that will seperate out the details like this from the high poly mesh. I have tried separating the high res fbx into multiple meshes, multiple materials, selection sets and polygon groups but nothing seems to work? Hope I have made sense here!

I was hoping the bake ID feature would allow me to set up selection sets or poly parts in an fbx which would bake down to a different colour on the low poly mesh (see 2nd image)
Hope someone can help!
Thanks
Mark

Hi

I believe the "Explode/Baking" workflow you are looking for is called "Match by Sub-Meshes Name" and is activated under the Common Parameters part of the Baking dialog window.
It works by only baking high res parts to low res parts that share the same naming. The Allegorithmic YouTube channel has a video about this feature.

For ID baking I personally use both the Bake ID feature with "Vertex Color" source (when baking from hi-res Zbrush obj) and the "Material Color" source (when baking from hi-res Cinema 4D fbx). Both work well for me - also when applying different colored areas to polygons of the same mesh. As this feature also has been available in the Substance Designer baker for some time, I´m sure you´ll be able to find videos explaining the workflow in SD.

I think both your needs should be doable in SP 1.3 (see to it that you are using the very latest build).

Hope this helps

J.

Be aware that the "Match by sub-meshes name" baking feature seems broken in the current build 650

J.

when you are baking normal amps and have a hard edge on the low poly mesh, you should always detach the UV.  This will bake the normals maps correctly.  Here is a great link for rules when baking maps from high poly to low.  This deals with xnormal, but the baking methods are the same.
http://docs.cryengine.com/display/SDKDOC2/Common+XNormal+Baking+Errors+and+How+to+Solve+Them

Hi

I believe the "Explode/Baking" workflow you are looking for is called "Match by Sub-Meshes Name" and is activated under the Common Parameters part of the Baking dialog window.
It works by only baking high res parts to low res parts that share the same naming. The Allegorithmic YouTube channel has a video about this feature.

For ID baking I personally use both the Bake ID feature with "Vertex Color" source (when baking from hi-res Zbrush obj) and the "Material Color" source (when baking from hi-res Cinema 4D fbx). Both work well for me - also when applying different colored areas to polygons of the same mesh. As this feature also has been available in the Substance Designer baker for some time, I´m sure you´ll be able to find videos explaining the workflow in SD.

I think both your needs should be doable in SP 1.3 (see to it that you are using the very latest build).

Hope this helps

J.

ID Maps - Thanks for the help there. I managed to get it working with vertex colour maps (never had the need to use them before). I got it working with material ID's but I prefer not to have multiple materials on a high res, as we tend not to paint them now that we use SP, we just go in and paint the LOD's. Vertex colour works great, hopefully they will consider useing selection sets or polygon groups in the future as an alternative option for baking ID's.

Exploding Baking - Thanks for the help there too. I found the video on substance designer five with the feature, but I was not able to get it working in SP (I saw that you said it seems to be broken). Will give it another go once an update is out. Again, hopefully they will consider using poly groups or selection sets as an alternative. It will save having to split models into multiple meshes which don't need to be split.


when you are baking normal amps and have a hard edge on the low poly mesh, you should always detach the UV.  This will bake the normals maps correctly.  Here is a great link for rules when baking maps from high poly to low.  This deals with xnormal, but the baking methods are the same.
http://docs.cryengine.com/display/SDKDOC2/Common+XNormal+Baking+Errors+and+How+to+Solve+Them

I used to work with x normal for baking. The issue isn't hard edges etc. The model is split up correctly and uses a cage and all edges bake fine. The issue is the overlapping polygons in the picture. The part of the picture is highlighting what the cage is doing. It is causing polys that are close together to overlap. Exploding normally fixes this issue, but as donebyhand pointed out the "match by sub-mesh name" is a feature that should remedy this once it has been fixed.


Yes, I would be great to be able to bake IDs and Sub-meshes based on polygroups and poly selections. It would save some steps in prepping the models for baking.

I’ve set up some macros in Cinema 4D that helps me with the process of making my low and high meshes ready for baking and afterwards simplifying the low res objects structure for final in-app use. But hopefully Allegorithmic will expand on the bakers possibilities in the future.

Glad I could be of help.

J.

I have done some tests and it appears that it is not working in build 650 as mentioned above. There was a comment on Youtube that it has been fixed, but doesn't appear so currently.

Very much want to have this baking method work so I can switch my workflow and utilize it.

Just tried version 1.3.3. build 672 and baking by "match-by-mesh-name" feature is still broken. Can get the same FBX files to bake with the feature in the latest SD, but not SP.

Cheers

J.

Yeah, it wasn't fixed for this release unfortunately..... :(