Allegorithmic is joining the Adobe family (part 1)

[gigantoad]

You can read Allegorithmic's comments in the thread on polycount, it appears to be fully amount money (when are these deals not about money?):

https://polycount.com/discussion/208172/adobe-substance

His certainty that nothing will change astounds me. Right now, their offices are not changing, no-one is leaving. That is right now...it does not mean it won't change in a few months. Adobe is now the boss. Therefore they will make the final call on things, not the Allegorithmic team and it may not be what the Allegorithmic team wants.

Modern history is littered with examples of major changes after takeovers. Oh they may promise right now to support the Allegorithmic team's vision, from software to customer support, to not change a thing...but give it some months, even a year or two and the changes will most likely come. None of the team's positions can be assured. They never are in a takeover. And how many times have you heard of company heads of the company bought out resigning or being 'pushed out' shortly after the takeover?? Why does Seb or any of the team assume this won't happen with Adobe? (Not saying it definately will, but you can't be sure it won't! Past experiences of other companies shows this is generally what happens.)

Not to mention, Adobe has probably gotten really good over the years at this take over thing. Sounds like they did just the right thing, been on the board for 2 years? Hit all the right notes? Been all supportive? Sounds like a pretty classic, careful and slow infiltration of a competitor. And a competitor they were, with a software that has partially replaced Photoshop for 3D texturing.

[CAGameDEV]

Time to learn Mari.

Can't afford $2000 for that. Yikes.

And what? We pay for a software not becouse we can not pirate it down in 10 sec, we pay for it becouse we wanna support it's developmant, becouse we TRUST in their development team, becouse we TRUST  in their leadership, becouse WE TRUST IN THEIR DECISIONS.
The relationship between a software company and thie community is the most important factor of their business imo.

I have friends that has huge software parks and they pay the most as donation to Blender : thats how it works.

This is why you hear about how CC is highly pirated... When you push customers away like this you'll lose more money in the long run. This is why you see AutoDesk doing "audits" on studios to confirm if they're paying for the right amount of seats and not just paying for a few but using several "unauthorized" versions. Studios cannot afford the crazy costs per seat. This is why I use Blender...

https://scottandscottllp.com/autodesk-audits-how-did-autodesk-know-to-audit-you-and-what-to-do-now/

Just go on their forums and see the outrage on price hikes and the cost for CC.

https://forums.adobe.com/thread/2463977

Short term money might look good now, but the potential long term damage needs to be considered.

I would assume such a deal would give the IP owner for Substance a good chunk of cash. Normally buyouts will put the prior shareholders in a good position to bail out if need be, but who knows... We don't have details on the numbers.

[RonK95]

We will announce new licensing options later this year, but again, rest assure it will be cheap and have a lot of value, we wouldn't settle for anything else.

I'm sorry I can't reply to everyone personnaly, that a lot of you, but we understand your apprehension and the last thing we want is to deceive you or lose your trust. We will keep on delivering and we will keep on being Indie friendly.

D'accord, JEREMIE. Vous avez gagné votre "bonus Adobe troll" pour la journée. Vous pouvez rentrer à la maison maintenant...

[Evgeniy Ivanov]

Blizzard merged with Activision because they wanted to focus on making great games while letting the publisher take care of all the financial decisions. Look how that turned out. Diablo:Immortals wasn't even made in-house, it was outsourced. Most of the core team left the company long ago, constant budget cuts even made the entire e-sport scene disappear.

It turned out well, they were all over the media.

[Mauk]

So, please let Pixologic stay strong. Couldn’t imagine what happens if Adobe eat them as well.

I hope you guys stay always true to yourself and keep on kicking substance forward.
Thanks for everything so far!

Mauk

[DBrownDoX]

Well that's depressing.

[davescm2018]

Wow - so much negativity and so many folk who can predict the future (and all bleak).

I hope that bringing together the two companies brings the Substance tools to a wider customer base and conversely brings some real innovation and 3D expertise to Adobe.

As a subscriber to Adobe CC and Substance I welcome the potential opportunity to bring together two subscriptions.
Whilst I understand the reluctance of some to use subscriptions I also remember the pushback against Adobe when they moved to that model. However Adobe have now have more Photoshop users than they ever had on the perpetual model.

I wish both companies the best in this.

Dave

[pevec]

Not impressed by these news.
I remember when Adobe bought Macromedia..
They destroyed Fireworks and other good products
So, I am sceptical. 

[Xathian]

Time to learn Mari.

Can't afford $2000 for that. Yikes.

You'll be paying $2000 in 2 years of the Creative Cloud license, and with Adobe that means you'll get 1 new feature for Substance in that time period. At least with that $2000 for Mari you own it forever.

[Kelthor]

How different is the 3D Coat workflow? The two things I enjoyed most about Substance was the automatic generators (dirt/grime) and the ability to use alphas to paint in buttons and detail with height maps. Is that workflow, or something similar, repeatable in 3D coat?

[Celessia]

Time to learn Mari.

Can't afford $2000 for that. Yikes.

You'll be paying $2000 in 2 years of the Creative Cloud license, and with Adobe that means you'll get 1 new feature for Substance in that time period. At least with that $2000 for Mari you own it forever.

Could you please tell me more about Mari? Im looking for alternatives. Does it go well with blender and ue4? Does it have a material library like substance share once did (it will be gone super soon with adobe in charge). Their website appears to be having maintenance atm.

[Gth]

I'm very happy for Allegorithmic that you have found a new family.

Sadly I will not be joining your new found Adobe family.

I wish Allegorithmic all the best and hope it works out for you.

[Xathian]

Time to learn Mari.

Can't afford $2000 for that. Yikes.

You'll be paying $2000 in 2 years of the Creative Cloud license, and with Adobe that means you'll get 1 new feature for Substance in that time period. At least with that $2000 for Mari you own it forever.

Could you please tell me more about Mari? Im looking for alternatives. Does it go well with blender and ue4? Does it have a material library like substance share once did (it will be gone super soon with adobe in charge). Their website appears to be having maintenance atm.

It's VERY different from Substance, admittedly its strength is about actual painting and is far more suited towards organics rather than hard surface but it can do both. If you're unfamiliar with Mari it will take you a long time to master it, there are good tutorials on Youtube.

[help_5]

My plea is to NOT follow the Adobe licensing model. ACC Teams is an enormous pain for us. We do VFX for large studios, which require our artists NOT have internet access. The entire ACC Team model is based on EVERYONE having internet access. This creates HUGE problems for us. And forget paying DOUBLE for the ACC Enterprise. That's just plain rape. Also, if you've ever tried getting an ACCURATE list of internet targets to poke holes through the firewall for authentication, you'll know that they never give you a complete and accurate list, and that the list changes with a degree of frequency. All in all, Adobe licensing SUCKS and has ALWAYS sucked. I'm hoping Allegorithmic licensing does not get subsumed into the evil overlords.

[Aneïle]

I do not care to pay as long as it's reasonable and justified. Honestly the only two thing that worries me is to have performing and innovative software and not unaffordable, reserved for businesses. Let's see some numbers…

Zbrush : 895 $ perpetual licence
3D Coat : 379 $ perpetual licence
Blender : 2.8 Free ( the best )
Suite allegorithmic : 290 perpetual licence (20,00€/mois + 49€)
Fusion 9 Studio : 269 € perpetual licence
Suite Affinity : 110 € perpetual licence

And there is more… So explain to me this: Photoshop 20 €/mois = 240 €/years. It's not much compared to others, especially if you are a pro. But what I'm getting at is you can not choose to pay or not the update. Why are so many companies doing this and not them ?  It is not yet comparable to autodesk, they are in space at the price level but Adobe like them does not leave the choice. I want to be able to keep the right to choose to pay or not.